--Previous Message--
:
: Jeffrey Taliaferro's material (
: http://www.geocities.com/jtaliaferro.geo/showa.html
: ) mentions that Nobuhito, then 8 years old,
: was granted Takamatsu-no-miya following the
: death of Takehito Arisugawa:
: "Following the death of Prince
: Arisugawa (Takehito) without an heir on 6
: July 1913, Emperor Taishō granted
: Prince Nobuhito the title Takamatsu-no-miya
: (which had been the original title of the
: Arisugawa-no-miya house)."
: [Henry Soszynski, not always reliable,
: however places Arisugawa's death two days
: earlier, same year: "He died spm 4th
: July 1913 in Tokyo, when this branch of the
: family became extinct."]
:
: Elsewhere in the Taliaferro material is a
: date for Nobuhito's creation: "cr.
: Takamatsu-no-miya, 14 Jul. 1913", in
: other words, a week or so after last
: Arisugawa's death, be it 4th or 6th July.
:
: I have an inkling that emperor Yoshihito
: 'Taisho' tenno had already during the
: lifetime of Takehito Arisugawa, informed the
: old (or, rather, middle-aged) sonless shinno
: about such intentions.
: Which can be seen as designation of heir to
: the miyake during the predecessor's last
: years. Mentioned sources speak against an
: interpretation that the young Nobuhito were
: yet so created, when the previous holder was
: still alive.
:
: Adoptions were forbidden by the new
: dynastical law as Hamish informed us; and I
: gather Takehito Arisugawa never actually
: adopted Nobuhito. The emperor's designation
: of the heir, and informing Arisugawa of it,
: probably meant to replace the legal act of
: adopting, to have the intended succession
: still in keeping with shinto succession
: patterns, which clearly were those intended
: to be continued by the designation.
:
: I can see no propriety mistake in describing
: Nobuhito as 11th Takamatsu-no-miya.
: However, it really depends on Japanese
: customs, as applied to the situation where
: adoption had recently become forbidden.
: Perhaps some would want to highlight the
: fact that adoption was no longer possible,
: by mentioning Nobuhito as 'first' Takamatsu;
: and possibly others would see him as 11th of
: the continuous miyake.
: One can always take whatever happens to be
: the IHA official record of that detail; or
: take what was the most common
: interpretation, in royalty publications and
: such; or take what the long-time Japanese
: custom (as opposed to the novel prohibition
: of adoptions) would mean; but any of them
: really may just reflect one of the two
: stances to the matter, without being
: necessarily totally correct.
:
: I guess, were I to write it into some text
: intended to be a work of reference, I would
: mention both interpretations of the ordinal.
:
:
:
: --Previous Message--
: Hello Hamish,
:
:
:
: I have been thinking about the
: Arisugawa/Takamatsu title. Should one
: consider Prince Nobuhito as the 11th Prince
: Takamatsu? I gather that it is considered
: correct to regard the 1st of the line as
: Prince Yoshihito, son of Emperor Yozei (II)
: and Prince Yukihito, son of Emperor Sai (II)
: as the 3rd title holder. Are these
: assumptions correct according to Japanese
: custom?
:
: Cheers,
: Christopher
:
: --Previous Message--
: Mieko was the daughter of Arisugawa no Miya
: Takehito and his wife Yasuko Maeda.
: Takehito was the younger half-brother of
: Arisugawa no Miya Taruhito Shinno (NB not
: Tomohito Ethere was no prince of that name
: in the House of Arisugawa). Both were sons
: of Arisugawa no Miya Takahito Shinno
: (1812-1886). Taruhito was the eldest (by
: Yuko Saeki, d 1841), Takehito was the 4th
: and youngest (by Noriko Mori, d 1902).
: Adoption by members of the Imperial Family
: was forbidden by the Imperrial House Law of
: 1889 so when Takehito died in 1913, having
: outlived his only son Tanehito O
: (1887-1908), the Arisugawa no Miyake
: officially became extinct. However in July
: 1913 Emperor Taisho gave his 3rd son
: Nobuhito the title Takamatsu no Miya,
: Takamatsu being the original name of the
: Arisugawa no Miyake. Nobuhito in due course
: married Miekos daughter Kikuko.
:
:
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