The L.C. Smith Collectors Association

The L.C. Smith Collectors Association
[ The L.C. Smith Collectors Association ]

Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?

Posted by John Boger on July 12, 2020, 10:06 am

My question is a general one. I've seen a lot of old breech-loading shotguns over the years. Many of them had their best years long ago. A common problem is that the barrels don't snap tightly shut any more. Is this a problem a gunsmith can fix?

Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?

Posted by Drew Hause on July 12, 2020, 12:46 pm, in reply to "Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?"

"Off-face" means the barrels do not fit tightly to the breech. Repair might be accomplished by replacing the pin, rotating the pin (if possible) 90 degrees, building up the pin via tig or another process, or a simple fix may be the appropriate thickness shim.

OR the barrel hook might be built up then filed, or shimmed

Peening the hook is NOT a good idea

nor is hammering the lug

Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?

Posted by Drew Hause on July 12, 2020, 12:59 pm, in reply to "Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?"

"Loose" (usually) means with the FE attached, action closed and locked, you can feel a wiggle with shaking the gun when holding the grip. Frequently the top lever will also be to the left of mid-line.
A slight wiggle with the FE OFF is probably OK.

With the very strong top rib extension lock-up of Smith guns, the slot in the extension can be built up and then filed to tighten the action

Check out What is the advantage of the "Treble Wedge Extension Rib" Rotary Lock Bolt? in the Design and Engineering FAQ
https://lcsca.clubexpress.com/content.aspx?page_id=274&club_id=43784

Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?

Posted by John Boger on July 12, 2020, 2:26 pm, in reply to "Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?"

Drew, thank you so much for that response. Yes, there is wobble in the barrels. Full disclosure: not an LC Smith. My Smith is tight; it's a different gun.

John

Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?

Posted by John Boger on July 12, 2020, 2:29 pm, in reply to "Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?"

Drew: Thanks so much for your respones. That clarifies a lot for me.

Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?

Posted by denver dillard on July 12, 2020, 2:56 pm, in reply to "Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?"

There is also a YouTube video by Larry Potterfield of Midway USA showing a process for non-Smith guns. It is interesting and features an old timer gunsmith associated with Potterfield.

Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?

Posted by John Boger on July 12, 2020, 6:00 pm, in reply to "Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?"

I looked at the video. Following a suggestion therein, I slipped a paper shim in between the hook and pin--took three attempts to get the right thickness--and it tightened the action right up. I'm not thrilled about the use of glue (lock-tite) to afix the shim, but it looks reversible so I may give it a try.

Any suggestions where I can buy the rolled steel of various gauges?

Many thanks,

John

Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?

Posted by Ken Descovich on July 12, 2020, 7:16 pm, in reply to "Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?"

John,
A cheap way to get thin metal is to go to most any auto parts store and buy a feeler gauge used for points and spark plugs.
Ken

Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?

Posted by Mark Robson on July 12, 2020, 7:21 pm, in reply to "Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?"

It's called shim stock and is available from MSC or the like. I got some at our local shop that sell welding supplies and taps and dies etc. Or you can get a feeler gauge and use the right thickness. If you aren't taking the gun apart all the time a shim will stay in place in the hook. You just have to watch it doesn't get lost when you do take the barrels off.

The Smith "Treble Wedge Extension Rib"

Posted by Drew Hause on July 13, 2020, 1:11 pm, in reply to "Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?"

The rib extension of my very well used but still tight and on-face 1906 No. 00.

The entire extension fits into the slot in the breech (Wedge #1). The "Double Cross-locking Rotary Bolt" rotates into the mortise (Wedge #2) and over the flange at the end of the extension (Wedge #3). #2 and #3 surfaces are both beveled and may be built up by welding, then filed to tighten the lock-up.

Occasionally the locking bolt is too worn and must be replaced.

Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?

Posted by John mistretta on July 19, 2020, 6:17 am, in reply to "Re: Can a loose action be tightened so gun will shoot again?"

You can buy a package of assorted shim stock from Brownell’s. Lock tight 680 works very well to set the shim stock on the barrel hook. Just experiment with various thicknesses to see what you need before permanent attachment. You tube has a video by Larry Potterfield illustrating the entire procedure. Interestingly he states that modern adhesives weren’t available to double gun smiths back in the day but don’t think they wouldn’t have used them if they were. I’ve used this method on several guns that locked up tight but had wiggle when the gun was open. It is very predictable, works very well, and is virtually undetectable when carefully done. Puts the lever back to the right as well. Tig welding the barrel hook also works but you’ll spend hours filing and marking and getting that done correctly. Another old timer once told me that if you like shooting old doubles you had better get familiar with shim stock. I was skeptical at first but it is effective and lasts well.

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