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Mazda 5 2.0 MZR-CD 2006 - Non start, code P0342 camshaft position sensor A low input - Fixed #

Posted by James Eardley on November 16, 2012, 8:05 pm

Year of Manufacture *: 2006
Engine Size and Code *: 2000cc MZR-CD
( Optional ) Scanner Used: Autel maxidas 708
( Optional) Fault Codes: P0342 Camshaft position sensor A low input

Hi guys

I am after a known good Cam and Crank sync for this vehicle please.

This Mazda 5 is from another garage that have asked me to have a look at.

The customer lost her power steering and the brakes went hard.

The engine set up and problem

The timing belt set up is on the drivers side (usual set up)
On the back of the INLET cam (above gearbox) there is gear that drives the VAC pump that is connected to another gear that runs power steering pump.

Bolted to the gear on the back of the inlet cam is the pick up for the cam sensor.
It is bolted on with 3 bolts.

1 of the bolts came out of the pickup and basically smashed the gears up.
(I have not seen inside, this is what the I have been told by the garage)

I have been told all the appropiate parts were changed and the vehicle would not start unless they unplugged the Cam sensor.

I have said they may aswell strip it back down but they insist they could not do any thing dirrerent and it was prety much idiot proof as everything had a key way and would only fit 1 way.

The code above was clearly introduced by the garage.

Here are the captures
BLUE = cam
RED = crank
GREEN = FRPS
GOLD = injector current

Cam sensor plugged in (non start)

Cam sensor disconnected (starting)

Cam and Crank sync

Is anyone able to confirm my cam and crank sync?

I am thinking possibly the timing may have jumped in all the drama?

No codes have come back during testing.

Thanks in advance
James

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by Piotr Sokolowski <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=UKAT1848' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 17, 2012, 5:43 pm, in reply to "Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"

I think your timing is 2 teeths out . I got the known good one but I cant work out how to upload it. Give me your email I will email it directly

Link: http://www.pandpauto.co.uk

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 17, 2012, 6:22 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
James Eardley

Hi piotr

Thankyou very much

My email is
jeardley213@gmail.com

Cheers
James

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by Piotr Sokolowski <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=UKAT1848' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 17, 2012, 6:26 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"

check your email sir. If you don't mind - you are more technical than me

can you put this waveform on the forum for people who will need it . Best regards and good luck

Link: http://www.pandpauto.co.uk

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 17, 2012, 8:26 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
James Eardley

Hi guys

This is the known good capture by Piotr

Thanks again
James

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by Carl Ford <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=UKAT1822' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 17, 2012, 8:59 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
Carl Ford

Any chance of having the psdata file please?

Thanks
Carl

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 17, 2012, 9:29 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
James Eardley

Hi Carl

You have mail.

James

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 17, 2012, 11:03 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
James Eardley

Hi guys

My inlet Cam appears to be 18 degrees advanced or my crank is 18 degrees retarded.

I have had a few beers
But
If the stray bolt locked the gears up on the end of the inlet cam then surely the inlet cam is going to reduce speed dramatically meaning it would be hard for the intake cam to advance?

equally
The momentum of the crank would cause it to advance when the intake cam locked up, not retard?

Also
If the crank pushed the belt round the cam pulley a couple of teeth this would cause the opposite fault in the sync.

Maybe I am way off the mark or have missed something, I will double check tomorrow.

What do you guys think?

If my thinking is correct then the garage may have overlooked some damage on the Cam or something has been incorrectly installed?

The engine seems to run pretty sweet with the Cam sensor unplugged,
but
I will definatley stick the WPS in a cylinder on Monday to confirm (if access permits)

I do not think I mentioned earlier,
The garage has not touched the timing belt side of the engine (all parts fitted were on the back of the engine) so this should eliminate human error with the physical timing of the engine.

Cheers
James

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by Alan Lange <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3293' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 18, 2012, 5:57 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
Alan Lange

Hello James, possibly sheared key on cam pulley? (cam-belt end)

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 18, 2012, 8:37 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
James Eardley

Hi Alan

Thanks for your input, I think it is highly possible the Cam pulley keyway could be damaged.

Both sides of this engine need checking, the other garage will probably be stripping and investigating the Mazda with the evidence I can give them.

I always try to work out/guess what might have gone off to cause the problem (I am known to think to much)

For arguments sake, if the back of the inlet cam (above gearbox) got wedged up and the motion of the engine caused the timing belt to wrench the Cam pulley round the wedged inlet Cam, breaking the keyway and possibly tightening the Cam pulley bolt even more.

The Cam pulley would be fixed in an advanced position but the actual Cam and Cam sensor pickup would infact be retarded?

I know it is nearly impossible to predict what would happen in a catastrophic failiure like this but, this has just got my brain ticking as to how the inlet cam could advance when this is the component that has momentarily stopped moving/slowed down.

I will update the outcome
Thanks for any input/suggestions

James

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by David evason <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3433' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 19, 2012, 12:36 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
David Evason

Hi James ,
Any chance you can send me the psdata too ?
Thanks,
Dave

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 19, 2012, 1:19 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
James Eardley

Hi Dave

It is no problem sending you the capture but I seem to have misplaced your email address.

email me on jeardley213@gmail.com
and I will send it to you.

Cheers
James

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by Kevin Apps <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=UKAT2589' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 19, 2012, 2:26 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
Kevin Apps

James

Just click on envelope next to david,s name in his post. Also could you send it to me please.

Kev.

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 19, 2012, 4:03 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
James Eardley

Hi Kev

I have just tried pressing the little envolope and got an error msg do you know what I need to do?

error msg

cheers
James

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 19, 2012, 4:09 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
James Eardley

I got your emails off of the members data base
Let me Know if your email has changed or anything and I will resend.

I wonder what the error msg is about?

I have not noticed the little envolope before, is that how you would send a private msg?

Cheers
James

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by Kevin Apps <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=UKAT2589' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 19, 2012, 7:17 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
Kevin Apps

James

PM are read/sent via the messages button below the head line banner at the start of the forums.

As for why the e.mail link did not work maybe has some thing with the fact you have no envelope, your addy is different to the one in your member,s data !

Oh and i have not received the file.

Kev.

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by Alan Lange <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3293' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 19, 2012, 8:18 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
Alan Lange

James, you're right(you do think too much!) but you are right - the cam would be retarded. I've tried to work out a way it could have advanced the cam but my head hurts now!

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 19, 2012, 9:04 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
James Eardley

Hi Alan

'my head hurts now!'

Welcome to my world LOL

I was going to put the WPS in a couple of cylinders this morning but the pipe I fabricated for a Vauxhall Combo 1.7DTi didn't allow access

but to be honest the car Starts efficiently with the Cam sensor unplugged, idles great and pulls like a train. I'm not sure the WPS would have shown much.

I have questioned the installation process and the mechanic working on the vehicle has said
'the sensor pick up plate may have had elongated holes'

They are going to strip and inspect their work and also inspect the Timing belt, pulleys and keyways.

I will update when I hear more, the customer needs the car back and the garage need the car gone, so it shouldn't be long.

Kev

Earlier I clicked on the envolope at the side of your name and got the error msg,
If I click on the envolope at the side of my name, it allows me to enter a UKAT members name and send a PM.

I will try to send the file to you this way.

Did you get my email but the file was not attached?

Sometimes when I recieve email with data files I find them in my 'junk' folder.
Maybe worh a look?

I will update my member details now.

David

Did you recieve the data file?

Cheers
James

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by Kevin Apps <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=UKAT2589' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 19, 2012, 9:33 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
Kevin Apps

Hi James.

Got it, the whole mail was in SPAM.

I can,t see an envelope next to your name !!!

Kev.

Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 19, 2012, 10:46 pm, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"
James Eardley

Kev

'I can,t see an envelope next to your name !!!'

I do not know why this is, I have been through all my settings.

I have emailed UKAT to see if anyone can shed any light.

What am I missing out on?
Does it allow me to send other members emails at the touch of a button?
Without searching for their email addy?

Cheers
James

Email Address Envelope

Posted by Peter Warman <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=Peter+Warman' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 20, 2012, 7:47 am, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 doesnt start with cam sensor connected"

Hi James

The reason you are are not seeing an envelope next to your name when you post is because you are not supplying a valid email address when you are posting

We have put a * against the fields that are required, if you do not supply a valid email address then the small envelope will not be generated

Supplying a valid email address is part of our terms and conditions for posting

Nothing sinister is going on

Peter

PS: If you click on someones email envelope and it does not open or give an error, this may be because you are not using an email client such as Outlook, Thunderbird etc, it cannot open your google or hotmail account. You can always click on the black figure next to you name to send them a private message or ask for their email address

User Options

Posted by Peter Warman <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=Peter+Warman' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 20, 2012, 8:33 am, in reply to "Email Address Envelope"
Peter Warman - Administrator

At the top of each forum there is a "User Option" link

If you click on that you can set up a Signature with your Name, Company Name and Email Address (anything you like) This will then be placed automatically at the end of your post......simples

HTH

Peter

Re: User Options

Hi Peter

I knew it would be down to user error.

It is me being thick, that is obviously why, when I check the, 'notify me by email' box ,I do not get notified.

Thanks for your quick reply

Could anyone confirm there is an envolope at the side of my name?

Cheers
James

Re: User Options

Posted by Peter Warman <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=Peter+Warman' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 20, 2012, 9:04 am, in reply to "Re: User Options"
Peter Warman - Administrator

Hi James

Yes envelope is there

Peter

Re: User Options

Posted by James Eardley <iframe src='https://members.boardhost.com/ukautotalk8/info/user=ukat3143' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on November 20, 2012, 9:14 am, in reply to "Re: User Options"
James Eardley

Hi Peter

Thanks again

James

Fixed #

Posted by James Eardley on November 23, 2012, 9:45 pm, in reply to "Re: User Options"
Message modified by board administrator November 27, 2012, 2:52 pm

Hi guys

before

after

Piotr known good

The mechanic said the inlet Cam had infact advanced 1 tooth

You will notice that the repaired capture is not the same as piotr known good?

All the keyways were checked, so I am told.

The vehicle fired straight up first time every time with the Cam sensor connected.

Also the EML turned out on its own.

I will check the next one I see, to confirm the known good.

Anybody got one coming in soon?

Thanks for all replies
James

Fixed #

Posted by Piotr Sokolowski on November 24, 2012, 10:38 am, in reply to "Mazda 5 #fixed#"

well done
well it is slightly out of mine. As soon as I will have mazda in my workshop I will test it as well.
James what you think about yhis ? This could help us for thefuture http://members4.boardhost.com/ukautotalk/msg/1353753158.html

Link: http://www.pandpauto.co.uk

Fixed #

Posted by Tony Sefton on November 25, 2012, 10:33 am, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 #fixed#"
Message modified by board administrator November 27, 2012, 2:52 pm

This is the Bit that I like.

>>>>>They insist they could not do any thing different and it was prety much "IDIOT PROOF" as everything had a key way and would only fit 1 way<<<<<..................................................

It Brings Back Memories of this job that we had .....

Our Local Tyre Company asked us to check a Clio starter motor, So We checked it and gave it back with "No fault found, Tests out OK"

They Refitted it and it wouldn't start, so they removed it and brought it back for retesting, Again "NO FAULT FOUND"

They refitted it again and it still wouldn't start. So they Ordered a New starter motor from us, which we got and supplied to them.

They Fitted the Starter motor and Guess what. Yes It still wouldn't start, So We got an Irate Phone call from their Boss saying THIS STARTER MOTOR THAT YOU HAVE SUPPLIED US IS FAULTY, IT STILL WONT START.

So I said Hold on a minute, We have tested your original Starter motor twice and can't find anything wrong with it so the fault is likely to be elswhere on the vehicle. ????

He then piped up with the immortal statement........ DO YOU THINK WE ARE FU*X?@NG IDIOTS, WE KNOW HOW TO FIT A STARTER MOTOR.

I said yes, You may know how to fit one, But you haven't got a clue how to test one or the vehicle that its on.

He said OK, I will take it off and bring it back for testing.

.

WOOOAAAAHHH Hold on a mo, Leave the starter motor exactly where it is, I will send someone down to check it on the Vehicle.

One of my Lads went down, located and repaired the short on the solenoid wire where the wire had rubbed through on the cylinder block and then located and repaired the bad earth strap to the engine and amazingly the car started.

I was just surpised that the idiot ( ooops sorry, Boss ) Didn't ask for a refund on the Starter motor that he didn't need in the first place.

OHHHH. I Nearly Forgot, Yes, I did Call him back and say, "WHAT WERE YOU SAYING ABOUT FXX@*NG IDIOTS"

Fixed #

Posted by Piotr Sokolowski on November 25, 2012, 11:34 am, in reply to "Re: Mazda 5 #fixed#"

nice one Tony
and that phrase/question is really in the right place.

Link: http://www.pandpauto.co.uk

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