My local garage had this vehicle driven in with a running problem which I understand to be a damaged cylinder head. It was decided to replace the engine with a second hand unit with the same engine code (RHY). This was completed and the engine turns over but refuses to start. I understand that it fires on easy start. On further investigation, it was found that the replacement engine came from a Bosch controlled ECU and subsequently the garage replaced all the engine management components from the original "Siemens" engine (incl injectors). The vehicle remains a non-start.
On my visit, I found the following:
Fault code PO341 - (Camshaft Position Sensor). This clears down but re-appears. The camshaft sensor from the original engine produces the same result.
No RPM signal on scanner.
No fuel pressure present on scanner.
The crankshaft position sensor was substituted with a known good one.
Now here comes the theories. I thought, and please tell me if I am wrong, that an RHY engine would be exactly the same whether it was under the control of either Siemens or Bosch engine management system. The other theory is that the fly-wheels are different and the flywheel from the original engine should be fitted to the donor engine.
I was asked to conduct a DTC check only on this whilst I was attending another vehicle and the garage is thinking of substituting the flywheel. I have taken sufficient interest in this to illicit thoughts from my more learned friends.
I went to a berlingo recently (same engine as yours) it had the head swapped, it had me scratching my head to say the least.
Mine had the same fault codes as yours with an added fuel pressure code aswell.
The fuel code was due to a faulty FRPS.
It is correct the bosch cam pulley is totally different to the siemens.
The bosch cam pulley picks up off of the actual spokes that make up the cam pulley.
The siemens cam pulley has a seperate pick up that is fixed to the back of the cam pulley.
when I was testing I found this problem seriously screws with the ECU.
When I was scoping the crank sensor at the ECU I found that if I unplugged the middle plug of the ECU then plugged it back in. The scanner would show the RPM signal and sometimes even start for the first crank of the engine only, after the first crank the ECU would seize to send the crank signal to the scanner.
I was lucky enough that the garage had still got the original head and cam pulley, and I quickly realised that the siemens cam pulley could not produce the cam signal I was seeing on the scope.
I believe this is your problem.
BEWARE!!
In my case a bosch head was put on the original siemens block, When I removed the top timing cover I could see the timing belt was not running true on the cam pulley. It was running off towards the timing belt covers.
The siemens pulley has got a different offset to the bosch pulley. The siemens pulley protrudes further away from the head.
Obviously when I put the siemens pulley on the vehicle the timing belt ran in the center of the cam pulley.
My worry with yours is that if you put the siemens pulley on your vehicle the timing belt may run off the edge of the cam pulley but on the engine side.
I think you are on the money with this. This vehicle also had a DTC relating to fuel pressure (high) but I didnt post this because I could not remember the P code. I will let the garage know tomorrow and see how things hang. You don't mention whether or not the vehicle was a runner when you first attended it.
Thanks to Dean and Dave for their inputs. Dave: Don't think my gas analyser does cam/crank waveforms..... will check later...
I did get accidentally get it to start by unplugging the middle ecu plug, gaining access to test components. This is when I noticed the crank signal was present on the scanner for one crank only after the ecu plug was reconnected.
Why it started I do not know, but for some reason the ecu accepted the cam signal and the sync
James
Re: Peugeot 406HDI - Non start
Posted by John Greystrong on October 22, 2012, 11:58 am, in reply to "Peugeot 406HDI - Non start" John Greystrong
As far as I know the Siemens vehicles don't have an in tank pump, the Bosch ones do.
Fixed #
Posted by Pete Mutlow on October 22, 2012, 6:07 pm, in reply to "Re: Peugeot 406HDI - Non start" Message modified by board administrator October 22, 2012, 7:40 pm
Evening All,
Original cam pulley installed and the vehicle fired up first turn of the key and runs nicely. The garage has been made aware of the cam pulley off-set.
on October 20, 2012, 8:28 pm, in reply to "
