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    Team

    Posted by Confused Hatter on 3/10/2024, 13:04:49

    Why have we become so poor seemingly overnight. I just don't get it.

      Re: Team

      Posted by Brko's Bicycle on 3/10/2024, 15:30:59, in reply to "Team"

      Nobody knows and if the manager did then he'd fix it instantly. But here are some factors:

      1) Bad pre-season. Half the current first choice team were still recovering from injuries last season and had no pre-season. Delayed transfer business in and out meant pretty much every place in the squad was uncertain until deadline day.

      2) Mental exhaustion. Last season the players played flat out every week only to lose nearly every game anyway. Even by the final few games of last season you could see that had taken its toll, and this season the players are struggling to find the motivation and confidence to perform.

      3) Loss of Barkley and Lokonga. Last season when we were up against it, we could give the ball to these two and they would look after it and give everyone a breather. We don't have anyone now who has the same technical ability and tactical awareness to lead on the pitch. That's going to take a big adjustment, especially with confidence being low.

        Re: Team

        Posted by Reality is on 3/10/2024, 16:59:21, in reply to "Re: Team"

        1, Delayed transfer business, no ones fault other than the recruitment team, which I assume includes the manager and at our club, the CEO (to agree funding). They are in the building and should know what's required.

        2,Mental exhaustion, also the Manager's job to oversee the medical/fitness departments to ensure the players are in the best possible condition for the first week of the season. Physical and mental condition is their responsibility.

        3,Loss of Barkley and Logonka, again the recruitment teams job, (which again I assume includes the manager and the CEO to agree to any incoming players) to realise how greater loss this would be on the team and bring in suitable replacements to make us competitive. It remains to be seen if Baptiste, Walsh and Krauss can be as effective to the team as Barkley and Lokonga were at the level above.

        Not sure how making your points are valid to the current position we are in, except to say the back up groups at club haven't done the job as well they should have.

          Re: Team

          Posted by MG on 3/10/2024, 19:20:45, in reply to "Re: Team"

          That's incredibly simplistic and misleading.

          He was giving good reasons why these things were problematic. For example no fitness coach in the world can get the right conditioning into an injured player. Just can't do it, even if you are the best in the world at the job.

            Re: Team

            Posted by Reality is on 3/10/2024, 20:19:24, in reply to "Re: Team"

            You don't think it odd that so many players were out injured from well before the end of last season to well into this season, Nakamba excepted due to ACL.
            You don't think it odd we have lost so many players to injury over the last 2/3 seasons. Do you wonder why new medical staff were brought in.
            Something in the prep or monitoring hasn't been right.

              Re: Team

              Posted by jimmyp on 3/10/2024, 21:42:44, in reply to "Re: Team"

              No. It's very simple, actually.

              Quite a lot of the players we've signed recently are talented beyond what we'd usually be able to attract but available to us because they have been quite prone to injury. We've managed to improve this aspect in enough players for it to be reasonably considered a gamble worth taking. Last season we lost that gamble because they all had to work so hard that they couldn't not break down.

              This preseason we haven't been able to get enough of them ready enough to start well enough. As Gander has pointed out, we can't magically make injured players not injured. We can't magically make players fit overnight.

              All the recruitment bollocks is just that, we sign who we can sign. We can't have ten centre-halves in case six get injured, we just have to hope that all six aren't injured at the same time and that enough of the better ones are available for as many games as possible.

              I get that it's attractive to think that it's someone's fault because then it can be quite easily fixed but sometimes it really is just what it is.

              Cheers, Jim

                Re: Team

                Posted by Reality is on 3/10/2024, 22:59:42, in reply to "Re: Team"

                You are missing the point,no one has said we can make players fit overnight, it's why so many are injured over a long period, that's not normal for most clubs.
                Why are our players picking up long term injuries, Nakamba excluded.
                If we sign players with an injury record they have to be managed more carefully, and really, we have to think about the number of players we sign with those kind of records.
                No one is saying sign 10 centre half's, but questions have to be asked, why so many long term injuries.
                Brko actually posted ( what I originally answered) about the mentality issues surrounding relegation from the Premier league, those issues have to be dealt with pre season by man management from the management team. They shouldn't be an issue in October. Its down to the management team to get the players frame of mind in the right state.Thats their job.

                You say we sign who we can, that may have been the case in previous seasons but I don't see that as the case this season, we must have some spare Premier league money in the kitty
                (not all) plus the fees from Ogbene and Barkley. I don't know if a fee was paid for Mcatee. We also have a few young players around the starting line that must also free up some money as they will be on less bonus ect.
                We can't always shop at Aldi,we can make a couple of visits to Sainsburys.
                If we want to be competitive we will need to look higher up the food chain, without going to Waitrose!!

                  Re: Team

                  Posted by jimmyp on 4/10/2024, 21:29:08, in reply to "Re: Team"

                  No, you're missing the point because my answer to this is not different enough from my previous answer to make it worth me typing out again.

                  We can't 'manage' the playing time/intensity of three centre halves (for example) if the other three are already injured.

                  Is(was) what is(was).

                  Cheers, Jim

                    Re: Team

                    Posted by MG on 4/10/2024, 10:48:55, in reply to "Re: Team"

                    AA few teams in the Premier League were suffering quite significant injury lists.

                    Newcastle for example were for some time about as bad as us.

                      Re: Team

                      Posted by Reality is on 4/10/2024, 10:57:32, in reply to "Re: Team"

                      But we have had the same issue for at least 3 seasons??

                        Re: Team

                        Posted by MG on 4/10/2024, 11:00:50, in reply to "Re: Team"

                        Not really.

                        We had an issue in the play-off losing season. Not so bad next season. Then an issue last season which we haven't got over yet as it ran through Summer.

                        I worry too but I don't think it's as simple as fitness coaches not being any good.

                          Re: Team

                          Posted by Reality is on 4/10/2024, 13:04:22, in reply to "Re: Team"

                          You must remember having hardly any fit centre half's.
                          It's not just one individuals fault and no one has said it is. The whole thing needs a review, buying players who carry regular injury and how we manage those players.
                          If we want to remain competitive and want to compete for a promotion position you won't continually get it on the cheap.

                            Re: Team

                            Posted by MG on 4/10/2024, 13:07:50, in reply to "Re: Team"

                            Of course I do. However, you were suggesting we'd had bad problems for three seasons straight which isn't true.

            Re: Team

            Posted by Music Critic on 3/10/2024, 16:47:37, in reply to "Re: Team"

            Fair post. It's not good enough at the moment but there are reasons and the first 2 must be part of it

            I'd add to your point 2 that when you're playing Plymouth, Oxford and others (no disrespect to them it's just the reality) when you've played United, Liverpool and Arsenal last year, it must be difficult to get that edge. They're only human. That's one of the reasons we needed a couple more new players to freshen things up. Having said that, the players need to snap out of it. But they need help by us going back to basics

            I'd challenge point 3 only to point out that we're playing a level lower, therefore the absence of Barkley and Lokonga shouldn't be so keenly felt but I still think you make a fair point

            I'd make additional points around suicidal tactics, 1 or 2 players with their heads down as they wanted a move in the summer (part of your point 2 perhaps) and a transfer window that didn't go as well as hoped

              Re: Team

              Posted by HH on 3/10/2024, 16:45:01, in reply to "Re: Team"

              They're all factors of course.

              But aren't they part of the job for being a football manager? It's his job to solve those issues and come up with solutions.

                Re: Team

                Posted by Ramridge Raider on 3/10/2024, 16:37:13, in reply to "Re: Team"

                Absolutely spot on.

                  Re: Team

                  Posted by MG on 3/10/2024, 16:18:21, in reply to "Re: Team"

                  Incredibly sensible post.

                  I will be reporting you to admin if you carry on behaving like this.

                  Re: Team

                  Posted by Logistics Leonard on 3/10/2024, 14:06:19, in reply to "Team"

                  RE had a free hit in the Prem. No pressure, just go out and do your best, come what may.

                  Now, when there is realistic expectation and he is expected to deliver, he can’t. He’s just not up to it. His natural level is league one at best.

                    Re: Team

                    Posted by Ummm on 3/10/2024, 14:23:42, in reply to "Re: Team"

                    there's no substitute for experience. Needs more time in the lower leagues where he'll learn man management and motivation.

                    Re: Team

                    Posted by Ross Barkley on 3/10/2024, 13:47:39, in reply to "Team"

                    Hello.

                      Re: Team

                      Posted by Lee Henfield on 3/10/2024, 13:09:20, in reply to "Team"

                      Overnight?

                      Where have you been?

                        Re: Team

                        Posted by Confused Hatter on 3/10/2024, 13:17:07, in reply to "Re: Team"

                        I thought we played some lovely stuff in the PL. However from Day 1 we seem to have struggled in the Champ against far less capable teams.

                        Re: Team

                        Posted by Gordon Turner Overdrive on 3/10/2024, 13:09:14, in reply to "Team"

                        Hexangol pegs in rectangular holes.

                          Re: Team

                          Posted by Oh Dear on 3/10/2024, 13:45:37, in reply to "Re: Team"

                          Not to overlook the fact a good chunk of the squad had no pre-season and are only starting to get fit now. Add to that a few struggling for confidence and you can see why our overall game seems miles off.

                            Re: Team

                            Posted by Yep on 3/10/2024, 14:45:24, in reply to "Re: Team"

                            Pre season was a shambles and in my long time as a hatter I’ve never known a season like it.

                            The manager even stated about how we would start slow and how difficult it was.

                            Wether that’s his or the clubs fault, hell knows.

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