The L.C. Smith Collectors Association

The L.C. Smith Collectors Association
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HOT Safety

Posted by David Williamson on January 19, 2025, 6:20 pm

Had an interesting conversation with our Editor Marty Stein, he had just acquired a 1908 16 gauge 2E with a HOT. He wanted to pattern it so took it to his club and set a target up and fired the right barrel and then tried to put the safety back to Safe but it would not move. He asked me if that was right and I could not answer him because I had never tried it. Never had any reason to. He stated this would make a great article for the Journal and I agreed. After we talked curiosity got to me and I went and looked at some that I had with a HOT. The first one a Specialty Grade c. 1937 the safety could be returned after firing right barrel.
Next another Specialty Grade c. 1913 could also be returned to Safe after firing right barrel
Field Grade Longrange c. 1927 could not be returned to Safe after firing right barrel.
Grade 0 10 ga. c. 1913 could not be returned after firing right barrel.
I have another but did not get a change to dig it out.

Question to all, if you have a Hunter Arms Co. gun/s with a HOT will yours return to Safe after firing right barrel?

I an going to look into this further and hopefully removing a lock plate I might be able to see what is going on with ones that do and do not return to Safe.
Wondering if they made 2 different types of HOT.

Re: HOT Safety

Posted by Frank Finch on January 20, 2025, 1:51 pm, in reply to "HOT Safety"

In an attempt to answer Marty's query, I did the test with a 20 Ga. Trap Grade with a HOT. After firing right Bbl with snap caps and WITHOUT opening the gun, the safety would not return to SAFE.

Re: HOT Safety

Posted by David Williamson on January 20, 2025, 2:31 pm, in reply to "Re: HOT Safety"

Thanks Frank, Marty told me about that. Maybe when you get a chance you can try a few others out.

Re: HOT Safety

Posted by Chris Frantz on January 22, 2025, 7:03 pm, in reply to "Re: HOT Safety"

I thought this was a really interesting post so dug out a few One-Trigger guns to play along. In each case, the trigger is functioning correctly. By that I mean the trigger fires only the selected barrel (doesn't double) and will not fire when on SAFE. All of course evaluated without breaking open the guns. Here's what I found (snap caps in every barrel - not to worry):

1. 1927 Trap Grade 12 Ejector (Selective Single Trigger) - I was ABLE to return the Safety to "Safe" after first firing either barrel.

2. 1929 Specialty 20 Ejector (SST) - I was NOT able to return the safety to "SAFE" regardless of which barrel I fired first.

3. 1935 Skeet Special Extractor 20 (Non-Selective Single Trigger) - I was NOT able to return the safety to "Safe" after firing the first barrel or second barrel.

4. 1940 Field 16 Ejector (Non-Selective ST) - I was NOT able to return the safety to "Safe" after firing the first barrel or second barrel.

5. 1950 Ideal 12 Ejector (SST) - I was NOT able to return the safety to "Safe" after firing the first barrel or second barrel.

Based on my samples, it would appear that they changed the One Trigger mechanism and/or safety between 1927 and 1929, but that does NOT square with David's findings. However, it does not appear that being a selective vs. non-selective trigger matters for this question. I think you probably will have to remove stocks to see the safety engagement with the triggers and if there are different variations. This seems like a question that Jerry Andrews could probably answer without having to disassemble anything.

Re: HOT Safety

Posted by Jerry Andrews on January 23, 2025, 6:27 am, in reply to "HOT Safety"

As a Gunsmith, who has worked on hundreds of the HOT single triggers, I have found out that 95% of them will not return after firing one barrel without opening the gun. This is caused by the hook setting on the post blocking the trigger safety mechanism from returning. Once opened, the hook drops back into the place where it started, allowing the safety toggle to slide over top of it. This is caused by the sear tab pushing down on the knock off block during the cocking process. As a note, there also are special frames that Lc Smith made with an automatic return mechanism for the single trigger. I will gladly write an article, including photos for the next journal

Re: HOT Safety

Posted by Jerry Andrews on January 23, 2025, 6:31 am, in reply to "Re: HOT Safety"

A weakened wire spring probably allows the safety to be placed back on as that spring is responsible for placing the hook on the post.

Re: HOT Safety

Posted by Steve Arnett on January 23, 2025, 7:42 am, in reply to "Re: HOT Safety"

This a very interesting and curious line of inquiry. I wonder if there was anything in the literature that came with these guns to explain how these are supposed to operate. I have stayed away from HOT guns, and in my opinion,this is another reason to continue avoiding them. It seems dangerous to have a hunting gun that can't be put on "SAFE" when you have a cocked barrel.

Re: HOT Safety

Posted by Jerry Andrews on January 24, 2025, 6:14 am, in reply to "Re: HOT Safety"

I’ve never seen anything from the gun company addressing this. Yes it’s a bad feature, or ailment. I love the guns but this trigger has been a bone of contention for many. I’ve installed over 50 HOTs in guns and I’m always amazed at the amount of moving parts to get the job done.
I think most of the issues come from a restocked gun and a gunsmith who did not understand that the trigger must be set solid in order to work. In most factory guns that have not been messed with the trigger seem to work just fine. I shot a 2E while crow hunting and put thousands of rounds through it and never had an issue with it but the gun had never been opened and nothing had ever happened to it. Jerry

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