The L.C. Smith Collectors Association

The L.C. Smith Collectors Association
[ The L.C. Smith Collectors Association ]

Really Rare Guns

Posted by Tom Breeden on April 16, 2023, 1:43 pm

According to the publication L C Smith Production Records only 16 guns were made with ventilated ribs among 226,000 total in 12 Ga Ideal and Field Grades. Even less with additional single triggers and beavertail forends. In attempting to document these guns in our LCSCA Journal I am appealing to the membership for any info including photos, serial numbers and/or descriptions of these rare guns. Has anyone ever seen or heard about one?
Tombreeden@aol.com

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by Denver Dillard on April 16, 2023, 7:38 pm, in reply to "Really Rare Guns"

This would be #17. Serial #134979, feather-weight frame, Ventilated rib, Beavertail forend, selective Hunter One Trigger, ejectors,12 gauge 2 3/4" chambers but with reinforced barrel loop, choked M-F. However, the Research Letter states: "12 gauge feather-weight Field Grade with 30-inch barrels, selective Hunter One Trigger, shell extractors, and a splinter forend. It was started on January 6, 1931, proofed and patterned on July20. 1931, and finished on July 28, 1931. It was shipped on August 1, 1931 to J.M. Kiefer & Son (Easton,PA) to complete Order No. 33182.It was returned to the factory by H.S. Young on May 9, 1934 for unspecified repairs or modifications. This could have been when the ventilated rib barrels, automatic ejectors, and beavertail forend were added."
The rib is correct for the period with correct posts and spacing and 2 ivory beads. Because it was a standard rib gun, the Vent rib has a 1 3/8" ramp up from the lug/frame and the ramp is engraved in Specialty style. The beavertail is Schnabel style with a correct recoil lug. The forend iron is a correct replacement with no sign that there was ever any other number. Small holes are drilled through the barrel flats into the ejector rod channels 5/8" from the breech. It appears that these are the original barrels.
Oh the frustration of Hunter Arms records.

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by Tom Breeden on April 17, 2023, 5:24 pm, in reply to "Re: Really Rare Guns"

Truthfully, I mever expected a positive reply to my request so I am pleased and surprised at your response. I offer four suggestions (1) post some pictures here, (2) attend the Southern SxS with the gun so it can be admired, photographed, etc.(3) contct me via email so that we (or you) can write about it for our LCSCA Journal and (4) some combination of the previous three. tombreeden@aol.com

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by Tom Garver on April 17, 2023, 6:10 pm, in reply to "Really Rare Guns"

Tom, are you willing to consider other options here as "rare". How about first in grade guns or 1 of 100? Another consideration could be "XX" or "XXX" guns. According to the production records there were only 233 of approximately 30,000 made from 1890-95.

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by Tom Breeden on April 17, 2023, 7:38 pm, in reply to "Re: Really Rare Guns"

Tom, Yes I am willing to consider any 'rare' guns about which to write but, for now, I am trying to finish the DBT gun series for our LCSCA Journal with the next and maybe final article about Ideal and Field Grade DBT guns...if I can find any.

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by Denver Dillard on April 18, 2023, 7:54 am, in reply to "Re: Really Rare Guns"

Tom,
I do not want to clutter up the Forum with personal messages. My email is denverdillard@q.com. Email me and I will respond.
Denver

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by David Williamson on April 18, 2023, 11:34 am, in reply to "Re: Really Rare Guns"

Tom, from what I have read, any double could be ordered with the Trap Option, ventilated rib, twin ivory beads, beavertail for-end and recoil pad. I don't know if that included the re-enforced loop.

Also not sure if this option was included in the
Record Ledgers on these guns, and how many were sent back to the factory this change.

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by Tom Breeden on April 18, 2023, 7:21 pm, in reply to "Re: Really Rare Guns"

You are certainly correct in observing that any double could be ordered with DBT gun features but only a small percentage were ordered that way in the lower grades. As mentioned in my last article in the LCSCA Spring 2023 edition a full 62 percent of 12 Ga Premiers were ordered with the trap gun package but only about 0.001 percent were documented in Field Grade as I will report in my article about Ideal and Field Grades this fall.

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by David Williamson on April 19, 2023, 5:26 am, in reply to "Re: Really Rare Guns"

Thanks Tom always enjoy reading your articles.

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by Bill Murphy on April 30, 2023, 10:02 am, in reply to "Re: Really Rare Guns"

Tom, my vent rib 32" Smith is not a Field or Ideal, but maybe scarcer than those grades. It is OE grade, #207,145. It has a reinforced lug and I don't know whether the barrels were replaced or just a rib installed. I fitted a set of 30", non ejector solid rib barrels to this gun, 00 grade #321,527. Everything works as original, ejectors eject and the extractors do not.

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by Tom Breeden on April 30, 2023, 4:46 pm, in reply to "Re: Really Rare Guns"

Bill, I didn't look up the year your gun was made but it was before 1913 when the nomenclature changed. As my articles are about DBT post-1913 guns yours wouldn't qualify because they were not 'officially' made with the established trap package before 1913. However, the gun is certainly interesting with the trap features of vent rib, single trigger(?) and beavertail forend(?). I put question marks after the last two features because you didn't say the gun had them.

Re: Really Rare Guns

Posted by Bill Murphy on May 1, 2023, 8:23 am, in reply to "Re: Really Rare Guns"

Tom, my OE was a standard field configured gun before the vent rib was installed. Double triggers, splinter forend.

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