The L.C. Smith Collectors Association

The L.C. Smith Collectors Association
[ The L.C. Smith Collectors Association ]

L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Chris Smith on August 12, 2021, 4:32 pm

Hi,
Helping a buddy identify his Grand Dads L.C. Smith sxs. It is a 12 Gauge with 30 inch Damascus barrels with patterns Almost looks like scrolling) Dual bead sights SN is a four digit 11xx. Barrels receiver and for end metal all have same 11xx number. Receiver under barrels marked with a feint A then a clear S1E Would like to know what grade it is.
Thanks

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Tom Archer on August 13, 2021, 10:14 am, in reply to "L.C. Smith sxs"

Your friend has a very early Grade 1 Smith gun with auto-ejectors. Without pics, it's impossible to know what the faint A and S stamps may be; but I suspect they could be associated with the patent date stamp. The key to your gun ID is the "1E" stamp: the "1" stamp denoting Grade and the "E" stamp denoting auto-ejectors. The Grade 1 gun was a lower grade gun, and all early Grade 1 guns came standard with Damascus barrels; but auto-ejectors were optional and an extra cost item (typically $25). This gun was likely made in 1892; but you need to order a research letter and to whatever details remain regarding the factory information we have on this gun.

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Chris Smith on August 13, 2021, 7:18 pm, in reply to "Re: L.C. Smith sxs"

Pics

www what is my screen resolution com

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Tom Archer on August 13, 2021, 11:13 pm, in reply to "Re: L.C. Smith sxs"

Definitely an early Grade 1 gun that appears to be in very nice condition; and a gun that also appears to be shootable with appropriate low-pressure shells (after first being inspected and approved by a qualified double gunsmith). We'd need to see photos of both sides of the forearm in order to verify the gun has optional auto-ejectors.

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Stanley Hackett on August 14, 2021, 11:18 am, in reply to "Re: L.C. Smith sxs"

I agree with Tom as to the grade, given the 1E marking. However, the gun has some other features which I find very interesting. It has "points" carved on the top of the receiver near the breech balls, which I understand are usually found on No. 2 or higher grade guns. The bas-relief feature on the side of the breech balls is not one I have seen on No. 1 guns before, and the engraving is more elaborate and refined than I have seen on other No. 1 guns. Col. Brophy said that the Hunter No. 1 gun was the same as the Syracuse Quality No. 2 gun. I don't know whether that is correct, but your gun could be an example. Nice gun, and I agree that a Research Letter might be worthwhile.

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Chris Smith on August 14, 2021, 1:36 pm, in reply to "Re: L.C. Smith sxs"

Here are pics of the forearm.

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Tom Archer on August 14, 2021, 5:46 pm, in reply to "L.C. Smith sxs"

The photos of your forearm confirms that the "E" stamp along side the grade stamp on this Grade 1 gun confirm it was originally shipped with auto-ejectors. The ejector mechanism seen here is known as the Type I auto-ejector system; and which system was problematic and later replaced by what it known as the Type II auto-ejector mechanism. This forearm is missing its wedge shaped ebony forend tip, which can be replaced. As noted previously, this is a very early example of an LC Smith auto-ejector gun, and the frame of this gun was likely from the inventory purchased by Hunter Arms when they purchased and moved the original L.C. Smith Gun Co. from Syracuse to Fulton, NY. Collectors call these guns "transition guns" because they were produced with combinations of features from both production eras. In the case of this gun, we see sculpted ridges on the bottom of the frame, a feature dropped very early on Fulton era guns (except for the A-1 Grade); and we also see records of a Smith gun "having been made into a different grade" during this same early period. As another poster has observed, this example has frame points atop the breech balls; a feature typically reserved for guns Grade 2 and higher, so this frame was most likely intended as the basis for a higher grade gun. This gun also features a bit more engraving than a typical Grade 1 gun. Examples of these early Smith guns with out-of-grade features are always interesting to collectors; so thanks for sharing, and again I suggest you order a research letter.

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Chris Smith on August 14, 2021, 7:01 pm, in reply to "Re: L.C. Smith sxs"

Thanks so much for the information! How do we go about getting a research letter and at what cost?

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Stanley Hackett on August 14, 2021, 8:46 pm, in reply to "L.C. Smith sxs"

On this website, first page, you will find a link for Research Letters. It will tell you all you need to know, address to request a Letter, cost, etc.

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Tom Garver on August 15, 2021, 7:38 am, in reply to "Re: L.C. Smith sxs"

Chris, one other item that no one mentioned is that your gun has the 3 position safety. When your gun is in the safe position the "S" will show in the small window. Pushed forward the gun will be in the firing position and stay there until you open and close the barrels or you return it to safe. Pulled to the rear from the safe position, it will remain in the firing position even after opening and closing the gun. You must return the it to the safe position yourself.

Research Letters

Posted by Jim Stubbendieck on August 15, 2021, 8:37 am, in reply to "Re: L.C. Smith sxs"

This is the link to the Research Letter page:

https://lcsca.clubexpress.com/content.aspx?page_id=22&club_id=43784&module_id=245742

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Chris Smith on August 15, 2021, 1:47 pm, in reply to "Re: L.C. Smith sxs"

Where can a forend tip be found?

Re: L.C. Smith sxs

Posted by Dan Wildhaber on August 16, 2021, 11:16 am, in reply to "Re: L.C. Smith sxs"

Chris, this isn't a part you can buy off the shelf. It will require a small bit of ebony fitted and finished by someone that does stockwork.

It's a fairly straightforward task but it might be wise to find someone familiar with the procedure and look at some of their work if it isn't someone you've used in the past

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