The L.C. Smith Collectors Association

The L.C. Smith Collectors Association
[ The L.C. Smith Collectors Association ]

LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Bill Retzlaff on December 4, 2020, 9:02 pm

LC Smith FW woes.

Part #1 - took a day off and went to the skeet field (8 stations, no waiting) this morning. Second round, station three, left barrel on 16 ga LC Smith FW won't fire. Turns out I broke the hammer (it's from 1946 after all). Does anyone know if the hammer from a 12 gauge FW will fit this gun? I can't find any hammers at Numrich, but have found a few otherwise along with a few reasonably priced FW lock plates (but all 12 ga, no 16). Please advise.

Part #2 - so tomorrow is Saturday. Skeet field still open (8 stations little waiting...) thus I got the 20 ga LC Smith FW out of the safe tonight - and it won't cock. Turns out when I cleaned it last week after rounds of skeet the "cocking plate and screw" in the forend disappeared (will be searching the ground where I parked at gun club with a magnet in the morning...). Fortunately the 16 ga (broken hammer as above) cocking plate and screw fit the 20 ga forend so gun will cock and can be used tomorrow (whew). I can't find an LC Smith cocking plate nor a used forend anywhere (with a cocking plate) - any leads? or ideas?

Thanks for any and all help!!!

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Drew Hause on December 5, 2020, 5:50 am, in reply to "LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

I'm no help with the hammer Bill, but Louis Rotelli can make the cocking plate and screw
mustangws1@aol.com
203-788-4920

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by David Williamson on December 5, 2020, 5:51 am, in reply to "LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

Bill the hammer for a 12 ga FW will fit a 16 ga. FW.
The cocking plate is the same for all gauges.

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Bill Retzlaff on December 5, 2020, 5:10 pm, in reply to "Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

Found one today and it is on the way. Thank you!

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Bill Retzlaff on December 5, 2020, 5:12 pm, in reply to "Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

Thanks Drew. I appreciate the information. I will reach out. How are you doing?

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Drew Hause on December 5, 2020, 5:26 pm, in reply to "LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

What's the deal with you and 16g hammers Bill?

Didn't Craig Libhart replace one for you about 2006?

This was right after we hunted together in Russell - Dirk had never seen flowing water!

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Bill Retzlaff on December 5, 2020, 7:15 pm, in reply to "Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

Hi Drew. Craig replaced both firing pins in this gun (they were broken when he refinished the stock). Other than Mike Orlen working on the barrels, this is the first bump in the road for this fine LC Smith.

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Cliff Church on December 6, 2020, 12:28 pm, in reply to "LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

Bill, there must be at least ONE person at your club who is a metal detector fan, they can work wonders for lost metal items. Mine sure comes in handy.

Cliff

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Bill Retzlaff on December 6, 2020, 4:11 pm, in reply to "Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

Hi Cliff. I used a MOJO Pick-up stick and a nail pick-up trolley and went over the gravel parking lot where I parked and cleaned the gun on the tailgate. I found several nails, a screw, staples, some metal aggregate, and more paper clips than I can count. No small screw or cocking plate to be found. The only other time the forend was off was in my home office - not on the smooth carpet their either.

Glad I got the nails out of the gravel around my "parking spot"!

The nail pick-up has found numerous sights, semi-auto handles, triggers and what not over the years

thank you.

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Steve Arnett on December 7, 2020, 10:05 am, in reply to "LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

Bill, in nearly 20 years of shooting Smiths regularly, I have broken several hammers, as well as firing pins. I have broken hammers on hammer guns as well as hammerless. Same for firing pins. This seems like a fairly common problem, enough so that there is a cottage industry for the firing pins. I have purchased hammers from Numrich, presumably off of parts guns (rather than newly manufactured). I have noticed that the nose of the hammers becomes dimpled by the rear of the firing pin. This seems to indicate inferior material to me. Any other shooters notice this dimpling?

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Cliff Church on December 7, 2020, 12:23 pm, in reply to "Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

You have it covered, My Man.

Hammers

Posted by David Williamson on December 7, 2020, 12:51 pm, in reply to "Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

Steve I can only speak about hammer shotgun firing pins. But I believe that the recess you are talking about in the hammerless hammers could be from the firing pin being harder than the hammer/s.
I know there are people out there making firing pins for both and they try and harden them with a torch, you cannot properly harden them this way. It takes quite while in an oven for the firing pin to reach 1500 deg. F evenly, then it is quenched in a sulpher based oil, polished to remove scale and shiny, then back in the oven until it reaches a straw color then quench again.

I have made many dozen hammer gun firing pins and have never hardened any and have had only a few reported that have broken. These were made out of 01 tool steel or oil hardened drill rod. Now I have switched over to S7 which is a shock resistant tool steel.

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Bill Retzlaff on December 9, 2020, 1:49 pm, in reply to "Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

Yes, I have dimpling on the hammers on a hammerless LC Smith sxs!

For the record, the hammer "snapped" at the narrowest part! The steel looks soft and porous to me.

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Mike Harris on December 10, 2020, 9:02 am, in reply to "Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

I do have hammerless hammers for these guns. They are factory OEM parts. Mike

Re: Hammers

Posted by Steve Arnett on December 10, 2020, 10:14 am, in reply to "Hammers"

David, I have an idea that there is more to fitting a firing pin than most folks appreciate. It's relatively straightforward to make sure that the nose of the pin protrudes enough to reliably fire, without being too long and piercing the primer. Is it also possible that they can be too long in the rear, causing the hammer to be deformed when the face of the pin hits the bottom of the hole in frame when fired?

Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed

Posted by Steve Arnett on December 10, 2020, 10:23 am, in reply to "Re: LC Smith Woes - simple parts needed"

Mike, thanks for offering these. I noted the same thing that Bill did, regarding the break point and the way the grain looks where they break. I wouldn't describe it as porous, but I'm no metallurgist. I still think a better grade of material might make the hammers more durable. On the other hand, something has to "give" in this system.

Re: Hammers

Posted by David Williamson on December 10, 2020, 12:19 pm, in reply to "Re: Hammers"

Steve, like I stated before I do not make hammerless firing pins, too much work. I do have prints for them and for the hammer gun firing pins which I made special tool bits to cut the sharp V angles. I use a dial indicator with 1" travel to get the dimensions correct to the print within a few thousands .002.

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