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Posted by Ralph Wood on March 13, 2025, 15:13:56, in reply to "I was being serious. I overlook the political jabs and look for useful information "
As I noted, AI is just a first step. I was not planning on stopping there. It just gives me a starting point to dig further. I am not at all certain of that first paragraph, and do not recommend going strictly by it.
I am certain, however, that, for select individual projects, the electronics do not have to start out US made. I don't recall which ship I was reading on at the time (it might be our new frigate) but the money awarded by Congress specified that "X%" of the first several production vessels could be foreign electronics, but that by a certain point in the production run, everything had to be US made. Was due to supply issues...apparently no US makers of these parts, but needed for the program. So, enough quantity of foreign made was allowed to get it all going. Meantime, various US companies had acquired rights, and were getting into production.
I can't see this translating to steel, but it shows this can happen. Should there be some serious shortage of something necessary, Congress can authorize allowance of foreign products. While the components might not all be domestic, the end product must indeed be US built. All our weapons must be domestically made for reasons of supply chain security. Bob above mentions having Asian yards do some of our ships. Last I read on that, we were/are trying to entice Asian ship companies to establish yards here in the US. But, that is not current info. Allowing them to be directly built abroad--if the legalities can be dealt with--in enough numbers to build us up in the short term is a creative idea. Then, like the electronics, we take over production at a certain point in the process. Would be great if we could bring ourselves to do that, but--like everything in military procurement--I am sure it won't be that easy or straight forward. There's just got to be a mountain of red tape in the way to overcome. 
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even in our political threads. I know you are a solid source for modern weaponry.
This thread is interesting in that I thought USN (US Military) had to be USA steel (and aluminum) as occurs with infrastructure projects funded with Federal money. Quite a surprise to me.
I do recall here I believe a few years ago it was mentioned we should have bought some Euro-design frigates instead of the money spent on some less than successful design. At the time I thought USN had to be US built.
As for the politics, We had plenty of dustups here over the decades and I understand how politics affects people. Most of us are quite senior and should have better manners than the "foolishly wise" we once were.
I thought you were in naval procurement. Damn you were AIing me all these years with my drone questions. LOL. I notice AI responses are, by little or a lot, less than 100% accurate. I never use it as the first results are what stays in memory.
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Well, Felix, I started where I usually do on looking into an answer...I got an AI overview of the subject. From the wording of the first paragraph, it appears they should but are not required to. This was to have been the first step into a whole lot of reading until I got to the part where the Biden administration was considering a huge tariff on steel. (Or maybe tripling is not huge? Let's see...1/3 is not small, it's big. But, that does not mean tripling something makes it big, does it? I get so confused. It's hard when you're clueless.) It seems I am a moronic Trumper who knows nothing about anything, but I certainly know hypocricy when I see it, and I see it so much lately.
AI Overview:
"The US Navy should prioritize using domestically produced steel in its shipbuilding programs to bolster the domestic steel industry and ensure national security, addressing concerns about reliance on foreign suppliers and potential supply chain disruptions.
Here's a more detailed explanation:
National Security Concerns:
Relying heavily on foreign steel for shipbuilding creates vulnerabilities, especially in times of geopolitical instability or conflict. By ensuring a domestic steel supply chain, the US Navy can maintain control over its shipbuilding capabilities and reduce dependence on potentially unreliable foreign sources.
Economic Benefits:
Supporting the domestic steel industry through shipbuilding contracts creates jobs and stimulates economic activity in the US. This can help revitalize the American steel industry and ensure its long-term viability.
Supply Chain Resilience:
The US shipbuilding industry has faced challenges in meeting the Navy's needs, including workforce shortages and delays in construction. By prioritizing domestic steel, the Navy can help ensure a more reliable and resilient supply chain, reducing the risk of project delays and cost overruns.
Current Actions:
The Biden-Harris administration is taking steps to support American steel manufacturing and shipbuilding, including considering tripling the existing 301 tariff rate on Chinese steel and aluminum.
Historical Context:
The US Navy has a history of using steel in its shipbuilding, with the "ABCD ships" of the late 1800s being a key example of the transition to steel warships.
Modern Challenges:
The Navy's aging fleet and the need to build new ships face challenges, including inadequate funding, industry capacity issues, and workforce shortages.
Future Focus:
The Navy is investing in its public shipyard infrastructure and exploring new manufacturing technologies to improve efficiency and capacity.
Industry Partnerships:
The Navy is working with industry partners to strengthen the shipbuilding industrial base and address supply chain challenges.
Examples of Navy Shipbuilders:
Huntington Ingalls Industries (HII) is the largest military shipbuilding company in the United States. Ingalls Shipbuilding, a division of HII, is a major supplier of US Navy surface combatants." Previous Message
Certainly in Federal dollar infrastructure projects there is Buy American regarding steel and/or AIS requirement. Previous Message
You do enjoy yelling, "THEATRE!" at a crowded fire. And when you do this nonsense, I have the opportunity to go off and read things, time permitting, which--being self employed--is usually "often enough." Having done some of that, I can tell you that we import only about 1/3 of our steel. Aluminum is another story. None of which has any bearing at all on the difficulties the Navy is having producing ships on schedule. They would fail at that even without the tariffs. So, you are basically connecting dots that don't have any association, purely for your own political fetishes. The fact that you have some freakish obsession with the man has me wondering about your mental well being, but also provides a measure of entertainment value to the more detached portions of my nature. There is a strange fascination to watching someone go over the edge. Indeed...theatre at a crowded fire. Previous Message
THEnaval aquisition chief says US shipbuilding is around 4 years behind schedule, and over priced ,in responce rump says we must buid very fast very soon and to cut costs,
so he applies tarifs of 25% or is it 50% or ???? to steel and aluminium imports,
and this despite a $6 billion investment in shipbuilding since 2014 and another $12 billion promised in next 4 years.whicch nobody knows where it has gone and if it has helped, perhaps a job for musk that could do some good, even if it is a sudden ship X shipard
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