1250 SCALE MESSAGE BOARD
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Re: And now...something different
The 1:5000 are definitely wood.
The box has the number 24 on each of four drawers, indicating that it was the 24th set made. Another collector I know has a box of just British ships, numbered 78.
On the underside of the box, is the name of the sailor who "liberated" the set along with the name USS GAGE APA 168. He lists his name and FPO San Francisco as sender and his name and address in Holyoake Massachusetts as recipient. He obviously mailed it from San Francisco to his home. GAGE was in the Western Pacific in various operations from 1944-46.
The set appears to be a combination of two different sets as there are more ship models than there are slots for them. I have never seen a U.S. set before. Only a British set.
The seller in Connecticut said that it came from an estate.
That is really interesting. Is there any documentation with the set and the drawer of 1/5000 scale models? The latter must be cast metal? As shown in my 2010 publication, the Memorial Museum at the Navy Yard in DC also has US 1/5000 scale models, but unpainted, as are the 1/2000 metal models.
They are wood with wire masts, and a few metal parts like cranes. These are smaller scale than the models in the maritime museum, which I think are maybe around 1:600. Also included in my set is a drawer containing 1:5000 scale models of the ships.
Paul: Are these 1:1000 Japanese recognition models made of wood and wire, or are they cast metal? They are of a different scale and level of accuracy compared to the larger ones I studied at the San Diego Maritime Museum, which were obtained after surrender.
Recently I acquired a rare set of Japanese made recognition models from WW II. This set contains a number of British and American ships all in a scale of 1:1000. Although the set includes HMS GLORIOUS which was sunk in June 1940, it appears that this set was made in 1941, based upon some ships in the set, in particular a KING GEORGE V, shown here, which has the Unrotated Projectile launchers which were mounted on board when the ship commissioned in December 1940 (and removed in December 1941). Assuming that the model was made in 1941, I wondered how the Japanese got accurate intelligence to make it. Looking at Jane’s Fighting Ships, I found no drawings or photos of the ship showing the launchers until the 1941 edition, which wasn’t published until sometime after April 1942. So JFS was obviously not the source. But Weyer’s Flottentaschenbuch 1941-42 and 1943-44, has a very detailed drawing of the ship with the UP launchers. Apparently the Germans had very good intelligence on the ship in 1941 and logically provided it to the Japanese. I don’t believe that these models were made later than 1941, because too many of them are of ships that were sunk in 1941 and early 1942.
By comparison, also pictured is a wartime 1:1200 model by Bassett Lowke. Note the UP launchers. Neptun also makes a 1250 scale model with UP launchers.
At least sixty UP launchers were made and fitted to a number of battleships and cruisers in 1940. The weapon however proved to be totally ineffective and unreliable. Admiral Tovey reputedly said that they posed a greater danger to the ships than to enemy aircraft.
Bassett Lowke model: