Posted by Carl/Mike/Steve/Frank on September 5, 2005, 9:14 pm, in reply to "Me too — Part 2" You know, guys, guys, when you’re choosing your wife, there’s one thing you can do to prepare for situations like the guy above in the advice column, to launch a pre-emptive attack against that situation ever erupting in the first place: when you first start dating, you can start out mentioning to her that you’re a naturist, and that you regularly go to naturist gatherings, and if that’s really going to bother her, then maybe the two of you... may not be the most matched to each other to start with. (And then, of course, really go to naturist gatherings so it’ll be the truth.) Once she accepts that nudity in other people’s presence is a normal part of your life and the lives of the people who are your friends and associates, then any situation that pops up where it just happens to occur, like with that man and their maid—and which, if we’re going to look at it realistically, may be inevitable sometime—it will hit her a lot more easily if you first started dating and got married with her used to the whole scenario of nudism and you being into it. In fact, if she’s prepared like that, then the whole thing may just get shrugged off altogether as nothing, instead of that “Then why did he DO it!?” attitude erupting and the whole marriage falling apart over it. _________________________ Right. There are a lot of women who won’t have any problem with the man she gets together with being into naturism. And then when you hire your maid, mention the same thing to her right at the beginning—with your wife right there listening—and tell her from the beginning that it’s your custom—or at least that that’s the way it’s done in your house—and if it’s really, really going to bother her, then maybe she might be better off choosing a different house to work at—and then when you do go naked on the way to the shower, or whatever other circumstance may come about, just make sure it doesn’t happen in a lewd way, that’s the main thing. Arranging your life—your wife, your maid, everything—in a way that’s going to work out better and fit in can really smooth things over a lot throughout life, rather than having horrible situations flare up like the one the guy’s wife describes above. It looks to me like their marriage is going to be breaking all apart now. It’s too bad they’ve already had their baby, because if their marriage isn’t going to work out, it’s going to be another child raised between divorced parents. The problem that man is in is that he didn’t choose his wife right—and he didn’t choose his maid right either. In the case of Araceli and me, neither one of us is married, and we’re both available if we ever feel like we might be attracted to each other in a closer way (that’s possible). She accepts nudity in our house as a part of life in this country where she now lives, where (as she thinks) nudity is such a normal part of life. Now I wish I hadn’t told her the fib about showering co-ed in middle school. Maybe I’ll find a way to re-tell that part, maybe saying that due to my poor Spanish I didn’t make myself understood correctly or something—and give her a more accurate idea of the percentages of society that are which way, and how there’s only co-ed showering in a few of the most liberal private schools, and at some colleges and universities. You know, I’ve never even touched her, except once when we were sitting at the table eating and she told me about some bruise she had gotten on her forehead and pointed at it. I gently touched it with the tips of my two fingers, and by her expression it didn’t seem like doing that bothered her any (she comes from a culture where people are used to touching each other more than in our culture, hugging and kissing on the cheeks when they greet and say good-bye), and once when I went away on a trip and left her to take care of the place, she hugged me when I left and again when I came back. Maybe I could start kissing her on the cheek when I come and go, like they do. But it might seem like an awkward change from the way things are now (maybe I should have started that when she first came to work for me). _________________________ ...there’s only co-ed showering in a few of the most liberal private schools, and at some colleges and universities. Yeah, like at UC-Berkeley. _________________________ Once she angrily confronted him about it in the first place, he needed to see about getting the maid replaced—and immediately. It shouldn’t be the employee who goes around laying the ultimatums on the employer, when she doesn’t agree with what the customs are in her place of work, like that maid, the way she warned him she was going to tell his wife about it. It wasn’t as if he had interfered with her rights—or even touched her, for that matter. There may be some employers who abuse, exploit and even sexually harass their employees, and true, such things shouldn’t be allowed to go on, but just being naked in some situation, like bathing his own body, and not even touching her, when it’s established that in that place of work, that’s the way things are done—especially when it’s within the confines of someone’s own house, then he’s the one who should be in the position of setting the standards for whomever works for him, not his employee setting the standards on him. It’s like being in a workplace where some employees smoke and others don’t. I don’t smoke, but it doesn’t bother me when other people at work do. But if there’s a workplace already set up where it’s already established that some employees are going to smoke there, and a new employee comes along who doesn’t, if he doesn’t like second-hand smoke, then he needs to decide if he wants the job badly enough to learn to put up with it or not, and if he doesn’t, he can look for a job somewhere else. The employers are the ones who should be setting the standards in the place of work they provide. Granted, there are some labor laws that are well-founded and need to be followed, but I’m talking about from a point of view of ethics. If something’s the custom in an already-established workplace, then the people who come to work there need to accept that, and if they don’t like it, they have the option of looking somewhere else for a job. The thing in these people’s case—like the wife complaining—is that in their point of view, it seems to be established in their minds as fact, that nudity in and of itself is an act of sex, and therefore its occurrence is taken by the maid as an act of sexual harassment against her—and what with his wife and her temperament, the husband naïvely accepts it that way too. Looks to me like he’s in the wrong circle of people. If they get divorced, then he needs to find his way into another group of friends (or maybe his existing group of friends might even accept it that way too), and if he gets married again, yes, like you say, he needs to find the kind of woman who’s a little more liberal about naturism and nudity, and who doesn’t get upset about it when it happens.
Message modified by board administrator October 5, 2005, 3:54 am
Before you get married, prepare your prospective wife for your involvement with naturist groups
Posted by Carl on September 12, 2002, 6:34 pm
Posted by Mike September 25, 2002, 8:23 pm
Posted by Steve on December 17, 2002, 3:29 pm
Another thing about the man above and his maid
Posted by Frank September 30, 2002, 9:47 pm
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