Tao Speaks: mud the metaphor

mud the metaphor

Posted by rat on 3/21/2008, 7:33 am, in reply to "Re: From Pi-yen-lu"
76.192.131.X

--Previous Message--
: i could well be wrong dagmar but what i think
: Pi-yen lu and rat are getting at is that a
: Buddha awakening in the world is likened to
: a lotus flowering. A lotus has to take root
: in the bed of a lake and rise up through the
: layers of mud and slime and water to blossom
: upon the surface. So the more mud the bigger
: and stronger the lotus. Similarly the more
: the water the higher the ship floats.
:

I think that is accurate Lian Dao. And some interpretations take "mud" to be a nuanced way of referring to a substance that the human being is repulsed by.

Some say we are repulsed by X because we fear we amount to no more than X.

An interesting question is whether we should deny, through some metaphysical device, that we humans actually are no more than X . Or should we embrace the possibility that we are nothing more than X, and by that surrender of status, thereby find liberation and find that we can still enjoy life to a suprizing degree.

X is also a symbol for death. (Cf- "Man you are dust and to dust you will return.")

Should we go with St. Paul and say "Death has no sting" (there is really no death). Or go with Zhuangzi (my interpretation) and say there might really be annhilation/death and I can have a lot of fun anyhow. Death cannot sting my ability to enjoy the moment.

Rawley Creed "I am X and have no dukkha problem with being X."

love,
rat

122

Message Thread:

From Pi-yen-lu - rat 3/20/2008, 7:27 am
- Re: From Pi-yen-lu - Steve 3/20/2008, 8:53 am
- Re: From Pi-yen-lu - dagmar 3/20/2008, 8:17 pm
  - Re: From Pi-yen-lu - Lian Dao 3/21/2008, 5:48 am
    - mud the metaphor - rat 3/21/2008, 7:33 am
      - Re: mud the metaphor - Wayne L 3/21/2008, 11:33 am
        
        Re: mud the metaphor - rat 3/21/2008, 12:11 pm
      - remember where you came from - Lian Dao 3/21/2008, 1:21 pm
        
        Re: remember where you came from - rat 3/21/2008, 3:04 pm
        
        tathagatha-garbha - Lian Dao 3/21/2008, 3:35 pm
        
        Re: tathagatha-garbha - rat 3/21/2008, 4:40 pm
        
        regrets? i've had a few - Lian Dao 3/22/2008, 7:45 am
        
        Re: regrets? i've had a few & what's the score now? - rat 3/22/2008, 8:19 am
        
        Re: regrets? i've had a few & what's the score now? - Lian Dao 3/22/2008, 8:26 am
        
        Re: remember where you came from - Wayne L 3/21/2008, 8:25 pm
    - Re: From Pi-yen-lu - Steve 3/21/2008, 2:50 pm
      - Re: From Pi-yen-lu - rat 3/21/2008, 3:05 pm
      - without a paddle - Lian Dao 3/21/2008, 3:39 pm
        
        Re: without a paddle - Steve 3/21/2008, 4:46 pm
        
        Re: without a paddle - gar 3/21/2008, 5:04 pm
        
        Re: without a paddle - Steve 3/21/2008, 5:32 pm
        
        Re: without a paddle - gar 3/21/2008, 5:48 pm
        
        Re: without a paddle - Steve 3/21/2008, 6:38 pm
        
        Re: without a paddle - gar 3/21/2008, 7:33 pm
        
        Re: without a paddle - Steve 3/22/2008, 8:30 am
        
        Re: without a paddle - Butch 3/21/2008, 9:42 pm
        
        Re: without a paddle - Butch 3/21/2008, 9:40 pm
        
        Re: without a prayer - Lian Dao 3/22/2008, 7:51 am
        
        Re: without a prayer - gar 3/22/2008, 9:20 am
        
        Re: without a prayer - Butch 3/22/2008, 6:07 pm
        
        Re: without a prayer - Steve 3/22/2008, 6:48 pm
        
        Steve Cultivates His Garden - Butch 3/22/2008, 9:13 pm
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--Previous Message-- : : : --Previous Message-- : i could well be wrong dagmar but what i : think : Pi-yen lu and rat are getting at is that a : Buddha awakening in the world is likened to : a lotus flowering. A lotus has to take root : in the bed of a lake and rise up through the : layers of mud and slime and water to blossom : upon the surface. So the more mud the bigger : and stronger the lotus. Similarly the more : the water the higher the ship floats. : : : I think that is accurate Lian Dao. And some : interpretations take "mud" to be a : nuanced way of referring to a substance that : the human being is repulsed by. : : Some say we are repulsed by X because we : fear we amount to no more than X. : : An interesting question is whether we should : deny, through some metaphysical device, that : we humans actually are no more than X . Or : should we embrace the possibility that we : are nothing more than X, and by that : surrender of status, thereby find liberation : and find that we can still enjoy life to a : suprizing degree. : : X is also a symbol for death. (Cf- : "Man you are dust and to dust you will : return.") : : Should we go with St. Paul and say : "Death has no sting" (there is : really no death). Or go with Zhuangzi (my : interpretation) and say there might really : be annhilation/death and I can have a lot of : fun anyhow. Death cannot sting my ability : to enjoy the moment. : : Rawley Creed "I am X and have no dukkha : problem with being X." : : love, : rat :

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