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Ear crop

Posted by irish on 4/1/2012, 6:52 pm
184.18.4.164

How does everyone feel about an ear crop on an Olde? (If done right) I know that most people may not like it, or in order to fit in, will say nay. But, personally, what do we all think? When i recall images from Old style dogges that had crops, and recent dogs such as hermes tank, and some of the dogs from buffdogs, I think they look awesome!
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: Ear crop

Posted by Sark on 4/1/2012, 8:34 pm, in reply to "Ear crop"

I agree, they do look awesome on some dogs. I'm not sure if i would do it, it would have to depend on the dog, head type and ear type I guess. I think the more rounded heads it would not go well with. For example I think It would suit your girl Nikkie very well, I think those kinds of ears are a good candidate for a crop, that's my opinion of course.
If you think you can, you can. And if you think you can't, you're right.

Re: Ear crop

Posted by irish on 4/1/2012, 8:56 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
184.18.4.164

I agree sark! I have always hated Nikki's ears. But overall she's a great dog. I would love to see her with an ear crop!

Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: Ear crop

Posted by Sark on 4/1/2012, 9:37 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"

Irish I have a question for you. How much of the Diatomaceous Earth do you give your doggies and how often?
If you think you can, you can. And if you think you can't, you're right.

Re: Ear crop

Posted by DL on 4/2/2012, 8:20 am, in reply to "Ear crop"
65.8.114.4

How would you like a little cosmetic ear crop on your ears?

DL

Re: Ear crop

Posted by irish on 4/2/2012, 5:40 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
184.18.4.164

David, how would you like somebody to keep you in a chainlink run, put your mediocre food and water in stainless steel bowls, force you to have sex without being able to choose your mate, and take your kids from you and sell them every time you have offspring? Then when they are done with you, remove your reproductive organs and send you somewhere else? These are dogs, not people. If you do it correctly, they feel very little. Just like plastic surgery for humans.
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: Ear crop

Posted by Brian_M on 4/2/2012, 6:50 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
Evolution Bulldogges

Puts it into perspective Ben. I like the response. Better to be a dog than a cow, chicken, pig or fish any day.
Evo Empire
Good things come to those who wait, but great things come to those who hustle. -Brian Miller

Re: Ear crop

Posted by irish on 4/2/2012, 7:53 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
184.18.4.164

Amen to that!
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Sark

Posted by irish on 4/2/2012, 8:20 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
184.18.4.164

1 tablespoon, every day. Zero working problems so far. MAKE SURE its food grade, though! There is another kind that is for the ground, and poison to animals
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: Sark

Posted by Sark on 4/2/2012, 10:40 pm, in reply to "Sark"

Yes I made sure it was the food grade before I ordered. Will start soon as it arrives.

Thanks for your help.
If you think you can, you can. And if you think you can't, you're right.

Re: Sark

Posted by irish on 4/3/2012, 6:34 am, in reply to "Re: Sark"
184.18.4.164

Hope it helps. I just sprinkle it on top of the food, so if they want to eat, they have to eat the DE. Some of them dont really like the taste all that much.
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: Ear crop

Posted by FREEDOMBULLS on 4/3/2012, 7:13 am, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
213.46.30.127

I totally disagree
They do feel the pain and what most people forget is that when it heals it has a very nasty pain during healing
But the sedation is already disappeared after a couple of hours but the pain of the cut is still there
It�s like cutting your own finger the painful bobbling feeling you get for two days that�s how it feels for the dogs
So comparing it with fake tits is not fair because humans get painkillers for 2 weeks and dogs in the MOST cases not

http://www.leavittbulldogassociationeurope.com/
http://www.freedombulls.com

Re: Ear crop

Posted by GeorgeF on 4/3/2012, 9:59 am, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
166.147.115.116

Are you F-ing kidding me!!! Are you really talking about the pain the dog feels?!?! Seriously?!?!! If that's the case you should never breed dogs either. Ask any woman who has children, what is the worse pain they have ever experienced in their life and see what they tell you and most of them get epidurals before and painkillers after. When you have a dog going into labor what kind of painkiller do you give it? Probably none, right! So don't give me that it's painful for the dog nonsense! It's a dog for godsake!! If you look up your history for years ear cropping and tail docking were done in sheds and back rooms by the pet owner w/ no anesthetic for hunting and other reasons to protect the animal from having the extremity ripped off while performing it's duty. Now a days yes it has became more of a cosmetic issue but don't try to say it's wrong because it causes pain to the animal. Give me a break!!
Death before Dishonor: I'll die standing and fighting before I serve one day as a slave on my knees.

Re: Ear crop

Posted by DL on 4/3/2012, 12:25 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
65.9.125.100

I will always do my best not to inflict pain on animals. Fu*king believe it. And I don't have time to argue with those who take an opposing position.

DL

Posted by GeorgeF on 4/3/2012, 1:25 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
166.147.112.246

Mr. Leavitt, by no means am I attempting to start an argument or am I saying that I inflict pain on my animals or any animal for that means. I'm simply stating that ear cropping and tail docking has been done for years, well before it was thought of as a cosmetic procedure, regardless of breed. So why does it make it wrong now?
Death before Dishonor: I'll die standing and fighting before I serve one day as a slave on my knees.

Re: DL

Posted by DL on 4/3/2012, 3:25 pm, in reply to "DL"
65.9.125.100

Hi George,

All of us have our own levels of compassion and empathy. They have been formed by our up bringing, life experiences and in some cases our religion. For many men empathy and compassion are dirty words or signs of weakness. That is very sad.

DL

Re: DL

Posted by GeorgeF on 4/3/2012, 3:55 pm, in reply to "Re: DL"
166.147.112.246

Yes, I do agree that sadly in today's society empathy and compassion are sometimes viewed as signs of weakness but I was raised that true strength comes in the ability, to not only harbor all your emotions but also have the capability to show them as well. I was always taught that if you are willing to step over a fallen man, you should also be willing to stick your hand out to help him up.
Death before Dishonor: I'll die standing and fighting before I serve one day as a slave on my knees.

I agree george

Posted by irish on 4/3/2012, 4:04 pm, in reply to "Re: DL"
184.18.4.164

I was raised the same way
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

David

Posted by irish on 4/3/2012, 3:06 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
184.18.4.164

You apparently do have time to argue. Do you hunt? Do you fish? Do you eat meat?
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

You demonstrate the Problem perfectly

Posted by DL on 4/3/2012, 9:52 am, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
65.9.125.100

How can you think that dogs handle pain with out problem, especially at the age ears are cut.

DL

Re: You demonstrate the Problem perfectly

Posted by Sark on 4/3/2012, 10:09 am, in reply to "You demonstrate the Problem perfectly"

Dogs do not handle pain the way humans do. My boy still pulls like crazy with a pron color on as if its not even there chocking and poking him. There is no way a human would be able to do that. So I'm sure dogs have a lot higher pain tolerance then humans do, and care less about it. That's why you can not compare dogs to humans.
If you think you can, you can. And if you think you can't, you're right.

Re: You demonstrate the Problem perfectly

Posted by irish on 4/3/2012, 3:06 pm, in reply to "Re: You demonstrate the Problem perfectly"
184.18.4.164

I agree, Sark! Good point!
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: Ear crop

Posted by FREEDOMBULLS on 4/3/2012, 6:50 am, in reply to "Ear crop"
213.46.30.127

Nope dislike it very much
If people want to breed dogs that look like Pittbull just go and breed pitbulls.
If you think the OEB has too much different appearances I would say stick to your breed standards
You can find the Bulldog line or OEB line you like most breed to that standard
That way you don�t need to crop those ears

http://www.leavittbulldogassociationeurope.com/
http://www.freedombulls.com

Re: Ear crop

Posted by Sark on 4/3/2012, 9:48 am, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"

Actually they do get pain killers, and if the doctor does not proscribe them, you can easily ask for it. Pittbuls feel pain too so your statement about getting a Pittbull if you want cropped ears is incorrect, if your talking about pain.
If you think you can, you can. And if you think you can't, you're right.

Re: Ear crop

Posted by irish on 4/3/2012, 3:07 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
184.18.4.164

Slightly uneducated views and comments, Freedombulls. But its your opinion nonetheless. Thats all I was asking for.
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: Ear crop

Posted by Al on 4/3/2012, 7:39 am, in reply to "Ear crop"
99.11.156.19

As a potential buyer/owner and not a breeder, I personally don't like it. You mentioned pictures from Old style dogges that had crops. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but I don't recall seeing a old or historic pictures of old style bulldogges that had cropped ears. I'll be the first to say I'm no historian. I just don't recall seeing any.

I want my Olde to look like a bulldogge and not a pit/bandog want-a-be.

Just my opinion.
Al B.

Life is short, so get on with it already!

Re: Ear crop

Posted by irish on 4/3/2012, 3:08 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
184.18.4.164

Thanks for your opinion, Al
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

For all that care to read....

Posted by DR on 4/3/2012, 8:05 pm, in reply to "Ear crop"
174.75.118.198

Honestly people???? It's a damn yes or no question that is 100% a matter of personal preference!!!! Same with docking a dogs tail! But if you are going to provide more than a yes or no, then keep it to the point and with all due respect, leave out a persons up bringing, etc!!!!

Example: no, I don't care for cropped ears because in today's society it's more of a "look at me I'm tough" thing rather than serve a purpose. For true hog dogs, I can see some cropping so the hog doesn't get a hold of the dogs ear. However, the cropped ear allows no protection from the elements, brush or anything along those lines.

If you oppose ear cropping then I hope you oppose it across the board with other breeds, like the Dobie!!

Peace!!!
"Boom here comes the Boom...ready or not here comes the boys from the South!!"

Re: For all that care to read....

Posted by irish on 4/3/2012, 10:57 pm, in reply to "For all that care to read...."
184.18.4.164

Well said!
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: For all that care to read....

Posted by Al on 4/4/2012, 9:08 am, in reply to "For all that care to read...."
99.11.156.19

DR,

You stated it much better than I regarding cropping the ears. I totally agree with the "look at me I'm tough" description. I don't like the thought of cropping the ears in general. As for across the board including the Dobie, that is an interesting comment because I can't recall ever seeing one that didn't have the ears cropped. Is there a functional purpose?

When I think of the Dobie and Bandog, I think guard dog and the intimidating look sort of makes sense. With the Pit Bulls and all the other spin offs, it does seem to me to be about looking like the badass on the block. It made sense when they were fighting, but I hope most people no longer do that. That was what I meant by my comment about trying to look like a pit/bandog want-a-be. I personally don't look at an Olde as only a guard dog or needing to look like a hard ass. I hadn't thought about a hog dog. I have no experience with that. The few tv shows that I have seen about hog hunting, I don't recall the dog's ears being cropped.

So the short answer for me is "no". I don't like the thought of inflicting pain for cosmetic only reasons.

Personally, I think most of the breeders on this board breed "BAD ASS" looking dogges that are popping with muscles! You don't need the ears cropped to make your dogges look hard. Just my opinion.

Al B.

Life is short, so get on with it already!

Al...

Posted by DR on 4/5/2012, 7:12 am, in reply to "Re: For all that care to read...."
166.147.113.244

Were you asking if there was a functional purpose? Were you talking about the crop or non crop ears on the Dobie?

I've seen pics of Dobies with both natural ears and tails. Not to mention some Rotties with tails left on them.

But for a guard dog, I feel the large ears cropped (as in the Dobie) is to help direct sound those helping them detect things that may need to be checked out.
"Boom here comes the Boom...ready or not here comes the boys from the South!!"

Re: Al...

Posted by irish on 4/5/2012, 10:06 am, in reply to "Al..."
184.18.4.164

This was told to me by a dobe breeder who i bought 2 dobes from years ago: The purpose of the ear crop is to direct sound(like DR said) to help the dogs be more alert especially at night when they are needed most, to aid in breed uniformity, and because the dobe is a guard dog, looks are needed. Yes, it it cosmetic, but a dobe without an ear crop looks like a hound. Few are scared of a hound. A dobe with an ear crop looks like a dobe. Scary.
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: Al...

Posted by DR on 4/5/2012, 12:23 pm, in reply to "Re: Al..."
166.147.113.244

Excellent point that I left out!! A natural Dobie looks like a short coat (black coat colored) Afghan.

Hey, WOW, Irish you have just helped me launch a new money maker!!! Gonna keep Dobies natural, breed with some Afghans and call them a new breed OR just leave my Dobies natural and call them RARE colored!!!! Money in da bank!!!!
LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!
"Boom here comes the Boom...ready or not here comes the boys from the South!!"

LOL

Posted by irish on 4/5/2012, 6:43 pm, in reply to "Re: Al..."
184.18.4.164

Do it !!!
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: Al...

Posted by Al on 4/6/2012, 1:08 am, in reply to "Re: Al..."
99.11.156.19

Don't forget to include in your ad that it will produce Blues!!!!
Al B.

Life is short, so get on with it already!

Re: Al...

Posted by Al on 4/6/2012, 1:06 am, in reply to "Re: Al..."
99.11.156.19

Thank you Irish. Like I responded to DR, I hadn't heard of the directing sound part.
Al B.

Life is short, so get on with it already!

Re: Al...

Posted by Al on 4/6/2012, 1:02 am, in reply to "Al..."
99.11.156.19

Interesting DR. I had never heard nor thought about the directing sound aspect.

Thanks.
Al B.

Life is short, so get on with it already!

Re: Ear crop

Posted by Bev on 4/4/2012, 10:12 am, in reply to "Ear crop"

Personal opinion.....nope, do not like cropping on the OEB.

I know you may be tired of hearing Veterinarian stories but in the early 80's I worked for a Vet who was known amoung the Dobe and Dane people as one of the few in California that could do a show crop. We did 10-12 a week. It is a horrible process....weeks, sometimes months of racking and taping on a pup. I did notice that some pups would handle the procedure well but some would have a different personality at the end. Very sad to watch.

The few crops I have seen on the OEB tend to be what we used to call the Pitbull chop job....very short and close to the head usually done by the owner without the aid of sedation or proper sterile procedures. If you are unhappy with the ear set on your dog....breed to the standard. Rose or drop ears. Breed away from the half-mast or bat ears.

Re: Ear crop

Posted by irish on 4/4/2012, 2:19 pm, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"
184.18.4.164

People need to quit saying if you are unhappy with the ear set, breed to the standard. Thats missing the point.

As far as dobes and danes, sounds like they were weak dogs. Ive owned dozens of dogs that ive had cropped at the vet, and NONE of them acted like it was the end of the world, and none of their permanent attitudes changed.
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Irish.....

Posted by Bev on 4/5/2012, 11:35 am, in reply to "Re: Ear crop"

You asked for opinions and I stated mine, along with a sample of my reason behind it. If I had known only one side was what you were looking for I would have refrained from posting.

Re: Irish.....

Posted by irish on 4/5/2012, 6:44 pm, in reply to "Irish....."
184.18.4.164

Really Bev? Temperamental, are we?
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

Re: Irish.....

Posted by Bev on 4/6/2012, 10:14 am, in reply to "Re: Irish....."

Yep....very tempermental.

A good friend passed away Wednesday evening and the daughter of another friend is now in the hospital with serious injuries due to a drunk young man who thought he could make it home.

I am not yet 60 and I hate losing my friends so young.

Re: Irish.....

Posted by irish on 4/6/2012, 3:45 pm, in reply to "Re: Irish....."
184.18.4.164

Very sorry for you! My heart goes out to you!
Evo born, Evo bred, when Im dead, I'll be Evo dead.
Evo Empire!!!

The bottom line is...

Posted by Cheryl on 4/14/2012, 4:57 pm, in reply to "Re: Irish....."
75.11.50.42

our own personal tolerance as to what we will subject the animals in our care to conform to our own standards. I have reached a point in my life that I don't care if my dogs look tough, I care what their hearts consist of. I don't care about tail docking or ear cropping ~ although it seems like a senseless pain to put them through simply to conform to popular standards of looks. Bulldogs have been so compromised regarding looks ~ I wish more attention be paid to what really matters in a bulldog and not the cosmetics. Let them have tails and ears, work on the mechanics. Give me a healthy bulldog with floppy ears and wagging tail!

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